I have collected some answers to my questions from several people that have been to Abydos Temple and also people who have studied the film. Nothing 100% definate, but I think this will help in our understanding. I am not here to judge, just to present as much data from both sides as possible.

The first set comes from one of the photographers Bruce Rawles of Sacred Geometry

>1. Was the Abydos temple ever under restoration this century, if yes
>could this be a joke of the restorators?"

Not that I know of, but I don't know for sure... I didn't look "tampered with", but mine isn't exactly the opinion of a professional archaeologist either. Since the image appears about 20 feet off the ground, at very least, someone would have had to bring a scaffolding or ladder (at the present floor level) to tamper with it! :-)

>2. The helicopter appears to be an Apache attack helicopter with a tail
>piece that is out of WWII.

That's even further out of my area of expertise. I'll forward this to my brother, Jim, who has more background in this area and perhaps he'll venture a comment or two.

>3. What does the Egyptian authorities say about this piece ?

I haven't heard anything at all about that; they may prefer to let "sleeping (or at least embarrassing to the mainstream world view :-) dogs" lie.

>4. What type of verification does the Egyptians provide with these ?

I'm not sure I understand your question, but I haven't heard of any sort of verification from anyone as to their authenticity one way or another.

>5. Have these been dated ?

The estimate I have from the Simpkins Splendor of Egypt series put the date of construction about 1300 BC, (attributed to Seti I around 1318-1304 BC) if you want to use that one, but there may be other more accurate ones elsewhere.


And from another Photographer of these carvings Sheri Nakken of Earth Mysteries & Sacred Site Tours

> Could you please answer these puzling questions.
>1. Is there someone in the Egyptian consulate or government that I
> can talk to about these carvings ?

The government is in total denial about anything related to UFO's etc.

>2. The helicopter appears to be an Apache attack helicopter with a tail
> piece that is out of WWII. Has there been any restoration of the
> Temple in any way ? If so, Could the restorers have done this as a
> hoax ?

This was not restored. This is an orginal beam - not a wall! It is up at the ceiling and was never under water! It was never covered by anything else! It has always been there.

>3. What does the Egyptian authorities say about this piece ?

They have no comment!

>4. What type of verification does the Egyptians provide with these ?

It is just there for your eyes to see. Temple supposedly dated to time of Seti I.



Dear Dan,

Your questions are well posed.

Beside the pictures we posted which are AUTHENTIC becuase I know who took them, there are some missing facts. I do not have these all yet. My understanding is that the panel covering this panel had crumbled. The covering panel had Egyptian heiroglyphs on it and the implication is that this revealed panel is older and may or may not be Egyptian. Other tourists could take photos. We (Richard Motzer and I) admit there are discrepancies between the video frame amargi presents and our still pictures. These pictures were taken later in time than Amargi's pictures and there could have been further erosion to the panel. There was no so-called "doctoring" to the image, but it was cleaned up and certain items cropped and magnified for better viewing. The still pictures have better resolution (film vs tape).

My purpose in wanting to upload these for viewing is to have them viewed by aviation buffs and engineers to determine whether these objects could represent aircraft as we know them.

Are proportions correct?

How about camber and diehedral?

Is there anything different in the design that looks unworkable or sylized?

That is the purpose of it - to stimulate inquiry.


Bill Hamilton


I talked to Harry & Ruth Hover last night who took the pictures in 1989 with a low cost Canon camera. I will meet with a friend of theirs late this January and will ask the above questions. He may have and additional set of photos.

I went to the ABYDOS site to look at their pictures and it appears that there may have been some alteration ,not of the pictures, but the glyphs themselfs, I mean other symbols added on top of the aircraft symbols. I will apply a fractial photo process to the Hover's and Abydos pictures to see if anything unusal comes forth.

Sorry that I can not be of further help at this time.

Richard F. Motzer


Thoughts On Egyptian Culture...

Well, here is my bit: I have spent time in Egypt, and hope to go back soon. I have not seen the photos now being discussed, but a will say:

1. Egypt has hundreds of thousands, counted individualy surely millions, of carved images all over the country in tombs, temples, etc.

2. Both The Egyptian government and the various archeological groups are sorely underfunded, and there are countless research projects in Egypt that are just waiting for funds in order to continue. Take the Giza plateau for instance. When you go to visit the last remaining of the seven wonders of the ancient world, you purchase your ticket from a wooden shack that looks exactly like an outhouse. The entire area has the infrastructure of a small farming commune in China (been there too). Sad, but true.

3. Egypt is both a third world country and Muslim. There is a big tendency for Government officials to firstly think of their pockets before they think of more humanitarian ideals. You would hardly blame them if you knew how much they are paid. Also, being Muslim, many of them openly disdain any talk of secret messages, hidden knowledge, ufos', etc. They do not want to discover any evidence that would challenge their Islamic beliefs.

4. On a positive note, I have found that the Muslims, the Arabs, are some of my most favorite people anywhere in the world. They are incredibly hospitable, helpfull, friendly, peacefull people. They are extremely distressed that we Americans think they are terrorists. They really do grieve over this. In fact, the average Muslim is just as threatend and afraid of terrorists as we would be! It is said that Cairo is one of, if not the, safest big cities in the world. Why? Because if you get into trouble on the street, every Cairene feels it a civic duty to get involved and help you whether they know you or not, no matter where you are from, and I myself have witnessed this. Compare that attitude to our big cities, and it is easy to see that whether or not we agree with their religeon, they have some things to teach us.

I guess not all of this is relavent to ISO, sorry Dan, but as Egypt and it's treasures are relevent, and perhaps may become even more relavent sometime soon, mabey the above odservations will be helpfull in understanding the way it all plays out.

Jack ---------------------------------------

Hey Dan
check Ancient Astronaut Society http://www.access.ch/aas

In the german issue of Ancient Skies Nr.4/1991 was the first time i saw the picture of 'the helikopter' taken by Hans-Werner Sachmann on an tour to Egypt in May 1990.

The article was signed Reinhold Mueller, Rennenbachweg 10, D-7900 Ulm-Donaustetten and Hans-Werner Sachmann, Emsinghofstr. 35, D-4600 Dortmund 15

Hope this will help you in your search

Søren (Soeren) Birkelund Hansen

I then asked Soeren,

On Sun, 29 Dec 1996 21:04:13 -0800, Dan wrote: I went and looked for the article and although my German is not very good, I do know some and I could'nt find it. Either my German is REALY BAD or that article is no longer there. (Most likely its my bad german) do you recall enough from your reading to possibly answer these questions ?

>1. Was the Abydos temple ever under restoration this century, if yes >could this be a joke of the restorators?"

1. not mentioned in the article

>2. The helicopter appears to be an Apache attack helicopter with a tail >piece that is out of WWII.

2. only mentioned that it looked like a helikopter, army tank or gun boat, and a submarine

>3. What does the Egyptian authorities say about this piece ?

3. An local egyptolog (no name mentioned) informed the author 'there is no hieroglyph that look like those. They are unknown signs. No egyptolog no what the are. There is nog hieroglyph wich looks like a helikopter' near enough translation

Nr 4/1991 15. Jahrgang Ancient Skies 'german issue seite 8+9' with photo on page 9. Issued by AAS, CH-4532 FFeldbrunnen

>4. What type of verification does the Egyptians provide with these ?

4. no information

>5. Have these been dated ?

5. no infornation


Thanxz !

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